My Pharmacognosy experience

brainman · Posted: Thu May 24, 2007 1:07 pm Post subject: My Pharmacognosy experience

In the late '70, I was a student at the Ohio State University doing work on a Master's Degree in Pharmacognosy (the study of medication sources). At that time more the 70% of all medications came from natural sources. Maybe a pharmaceutical company had found a way to mass produce it in a factory, but its origin was a plant or a mold or a fungus. One anti-cancer agent is vincristine. It comes from a very common little flowering plant that most of us have seen commonly know as Rosy Periwinkle.

I am telling you this in order to make it clear that I am not against alternative medicines. What once was an alternative medicine may one day be a common prescription medication. To me, the significant difference is the body of scientific evidence that was generated to show that vincristine was effective and (somewhat) safe for use with cancer patients. However, I would never go out to my garden and pick some periwinkle flowers for a tea to try to replace vincristine!! That is the danger of most "alternative" medicines. Folk tales are a great source to start exploring for new medications but hardly a substitute for well researched proof of efficacy and safety.
_________________
Jim
Site Administrator and long-term cancer survivor
1992 Astrocytoma grade 2, left motor strip
2005 Recurrence this time said to be an Oligodendoglioma grade 3, same location.
My Story Part 1: http://cancerforums.net/viewtopic.php?p=7350
My Story Part 2: http://cancerforums.net/viewtopic.php?t=8029
Blog http://jimhawkinsport.blogspot.com/

anjou · Experienced user Joined: 01 Jul 2005 Posts: 65

Jim is right on with the points raised!!

I'm a cancer survivor married to a distinguished oncology researcher who is involved with several NCI natrl products committees, and we have contact with leading pharmacognosy and cancer treatment researchers. These are the guys who write the abstracts frequently misused by alt med peddlers (Much to their annoyance) and guys who are on NCI CAM committees, determine if herbal research is funded etc etc. None of these leading experts have recommended that I take supplements to help my cancer or improve my prognosis

Lay folks just dont seem to get that just because something works in a test tube or mouse model, that issues like dosages, bioavailability, toxicity etc have not yet been worked out for humans, and the in vivo and in vitro abstracts are thrown around as part of supplement advertising ploys.

As Brainman points out, many cancer drugs were derived from plants or marine products-- etoposides were developed from compounds in mayapples, taxol from yew bark etc etc. However, to get the full amt of yew bark in taxol dose one would have to ingest something like the bark of one and a half yew trees....yum-- be my guest.

Should you be interested in learning about the field of pharmacognosy and issues involved in cancer treatment-- this blogger is an excellent resource

http://scienceblogs.com/terrasig/

and here are his thoughts on curcumin, a supplement frequently pushed at cancer patients that give insight into the issues involved, and although specific to curcumin the ideas presented extend to other nonsense pushed at cancer patients--

http://scienceblogs.com/terrasig/2006/10/curcumin_for_cancer.php

http://scienceblogs.com/terrasig/2006/10/curcumin_for_cancer_part_two_1.php
_________________
Follicular lymphoma grade 3, stage 2 dx 9/99 CHOP x 3 3600 rads rituxan x4

anjou · Experienced user Joined: 01 Jul 2005 Posts: 65

Goldring--
This discussion might give further insight into areas where there problems with alt meds (this guy is respectable IMHO) http://www.altmedconsult.com/index.php?page=archive&article=true&articleNum=11_4_03.txt
_________________
Follicular lymphoma grade 3, stage 2 dx 9/99 CHOP x 3 3600 rads rituxan x4

anjou · Experienced user Joined: 01 Jul 2005 Posts: 65

Goldring-- we have collected a number of useful info and sites on our site for lymphoma patients re alt meds and issues involved

http://www.lymphomation.org/wwlife.htm
_________________
Follicular lymphoma grade 3, stage 2 dx 9/99 CHOP x 3 3600 rads rituxan x4

brainman · Last edited by brainman on Sat May 26, 2007 11:40 pm; edited 1 time in total

Hi goldring and anjou,

Let me once more state that I am not against alternative medicine; I am just cautious. My major professor at OSU used to tell a story about an experience of his. He heard that natives in the Amazon used a plant to ease the pain of tooth aches. Thinking that this plant might have some use in the area of anesthesia, he obtained a large quantity of this plant and started through the long process of extracting the contents. To test his extracts he did a very dumb thing... he would put his finger into the solution and then put his finger in his mouth. As the solution passed through the column of silica, the chemical contents of the plant separated and became more concentrated. Finally, the "anesthetic" chemical came through. He dipped his finger into the test tube and paced hims finger into his month. His month started to burn like fire. It started to swell to the point that he had to go to the hospital because it was affecting his breathing. His conclusion was that what might seem to kill pain at a low concentration, can potentially kill you at higher concentrations.

I think the same is true for a lot of other alternative medicines. Of course, some are helpful and just have not gone though the lengthy testing protocols required for approval. But some have proven dangers associated with them and the risk out weighs the benefit.
_________________
Jim
Site Administrator and long-term cancer survivor
1992 Astrocytoma grade 2, left motor strip
2005 Recurrence this time said to be an Oligodendoglioma grade 3, same location.
My Story Part 1: http://cancerforums.net/viewtopic.php?p=7350
My Story Part 2: http://cancerforums.net/viewtopic.php?t=8029
Blog http://jimhawkinsport.blogspot.com/

anjou · Experienced user Joined: 01 Jul 2005 Posts: 65

a compelling story by a dear friend

http://www.lymphomation.org/story-kandj.htm
_________________
Follicular lymphoma grade 3, stage 2 dx 9/99 CHOP x 3 3600 rads rituxan x4

brainman · Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 2:04 pm Post subject: Re: My Pharmacognosy experience

anjou, wonderful article! Thank you for posting the link!
_________________
Jim
Site Administrator and long-term cancer survivor
1992 Astrocytoma grade 2, left motor strip
2005 Recurrence this time said to be an Oligodendoglioma grade 3, same location.
My Story Part 1: http://cancerforums.net/viewtopic.php?p=7350
My Story Part 2: http://cancerforums.net/viewtopic.php?t=8029
Blog http://jimhawkinsport.blogspot.com/

anjou · Experienced user Joined: 01 Jul 2005 Posts: 65

Hi Jim-- You're welcome! Not sure which article as I posted a bunch on this thread. I think they all are worthwhile reads.

anjou
_________________
Follicular lymphoma grade 3, stage 2 dx 9/99 CHOP x 3 3600 rads rituxan x4

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